King of the Muscle Cars

[Survivor 69/Z28]

IMO the 1970 Chevelle SS LS6 is very hard to argue that its not King.
The ZL1 Camaros were amazing of course, but lets face it that is an "extremely" rare car and I don't see how you can put that in with general musclecars of the day. To be king it has to do everything well IMO. Fast, build quality, solid interior, handling, and just overall well sorted out. I have the LS6 at the top of the list. There are other cars to make the argument, but you can't argue the fact that GM musclecars were overall the most sorted out right out of the box.

[EZ Nova]

Funny, I don't see the overweight LS-6 being on the top of the list as far as ET's are concerned? They were a bit limited in availability to about 4500 in 1 year of production, and I honestly don't think it has much of an advantage (other than Hp rating) over a a L-78 Nova? I happen to know of a '69 L-78 Nova, headers slick and re-curved dist and it was an 11.70 car back in 1969. PLUS it was available for 3 years (68-70) and was a bunch cheaper then the LS-6.

Is this not exactly the reason Don Yenko waited for a COPO version of the Nova 427 before he would jump in with a YSC version? Curb weight of a SS396 Nova 4sp "on-line" is 3370 as posted here:

http://www.automobile-catalog.com/ma...e_ss/1969.html

Curb weight of a 1970 SS454 4sp LS-6 is 3743 as posted on the same site:

http://www.automobile-catalog.com/ma...e_ss/1970.html

So a 396 Nova would be 378 lbs lighter and we all know the L-78 can run HARD as well.

Therefore, I really think the SS396 Nova we the actual street KING. ET wise, there were very hard to beat, available for 3 years with hi compression, and low buck so more could afford them.

Then you can talk about the COPO 427 Nova's!!!! Only the Zl-1 and the A990/'68 Hemi cars could run with that beast.

[EZ Nova]

Have you guys seen this list:

http://roadtests.tripod.com/

BUNCH of test from the time of different cars and times they ran?

[Lee Stewart]

Originally Posted by EZ Nova

Then you can talk about the COPO 427 Nova's!!!! Only the Zl-1 and the A990/'68 Hemi cars could run with that beast.

There were no COPO 427 Novas. Chevrolet refused to put the L72 427 in a Nova for Don Yenko or anyone else for that matter. All the 1969 Yenko 427 Novas were engine swaps. Cars were ordered as L78s then the short block 396 was replaced with a short block L72 427. The L78 heads, intake and exhaust manifolds were then put back on.

Chevrolet built 4 COPO cars:

1968 L78 Nova SS396 with special HD TH400
1969 L72 427 Camaro
1969 L72 427 Chevelle
1969 ZL1 Camaro

[EZ Nova]

Sorry, I thought they DID come with 427 from the factory? Something about 37 to Yenko and 50 to Gibbs or Dana or something like that??? I thought for some reason a couple of the early '69 Yenko Nova's were conversions as COPO was on board with the other 37???

I could be wrong? If I am, opps my bad.

[Lee Stewart]

Originally Posted by EZ Nova

Sorry, I thought they DID come with 427 from the factory? Something about 37 to Yenko and 50 to Gibbs or Dana or something like that??? I thought for some reason a couple of the early '69 Yenko Nova's were conversions as COPO was on board with the other 37???

I could be wrong? If I am, opps my bad.

Yenko built approx. 37 1969 427 Nova Super Sports.

The 50 are the ones Chevy built for Fred Gibbs (COPO 9738) - 1968 L78 Nova SS396 with the special HD TH400 - the first cars to have a TH400 behind a solid lifter Hi Performance BB engine. They also came standard with power drum brakes, HD radiator and a 4.10 posi 12 bolt rear.

[69LM1]

Originally Posted by Lee Stewart

There were no COPO 427 Novas. Chevrolet refused to put the L72 427 in a Nova for Don Yenko or anyone else for that matter. All the 1969 Yenko 427 Novas were engine swaps. Cars were ordered as L78s then the short block 396 was replaced with a short block L72 427. The L78 heads, intake and exhaust manifolds were then put back on.

Chevrolet built 4 COPO cars:

1968 L78 Nova SS396 with special HD TH400
1969 L72 427 Camaro
1969 L72 427 Chevelle
1969 ZL1 Camaro

More pot stirring...... Don't leave out the step child, The 70Z28 COPO 9796... Different kinda racing but...



Rich

[Lee Stewart]

Originally Posted by 69LM1

More pot stirring...... Don't leave out the step child, The 70Z28 COPO 9796... Different kinda racing but...



Rich

LOL - that was nothing but a rear spoiler Chevy stole . . . urr . . . borrowed from the Pontiac Trans Am.

Well Rich - if you really want to "stir the pot" don't forget about COPO 9511 . . . . . 1969 Camaro: 4.56/4.88 gears (includes Positraction)

[SeattleCarGuy]

I have huge respect for the LS-6 Chevelle as one of my favorites and a beautiful car by all measures. Ordered with a 4.10 rear and bench seat, non-power steering and an M-22 (with an aftermarket shifter), it would be tough to beat on the street, and tough to beat for style and looks at the local cruise spot in 1970.

I second the L78 Nova as a great street racer. Mine was ordered with only two options beyond the mandatory SS package and positraction to get the L78/M40. The options on my car are tinted glass and AM radio. Went straight to Milan Dragway when new in code 50 Dover White (aka "Race car white").

I wish Gary Oldham was a member on this site and could chime in since he lived this stuff in the 1960's/70's as evidenced by his book, Musclecar Confidential. I was surprised that he didn't have an LS6 Chevelle road test to submit? Also, I recall from reading the book cover to cover many times, he doesn't give much respect to the Fords, stating that on the street they didn't have much going until the '68 Cobra Jet Mustangs made the scene.

Today, while I am a Chevrolet enthusiast and hope to build my small collection to maybe a dozen cars over the next decade or so, I appreciate all well restored or original muscle cars. In high school we all argued over what was fastest and which cars "SUCK!!", but today, I see the beauty in all of them.

[Crush]

Originally Posted by EZ Nova

Funny, I don't see the overweight LS-6 being on the top of the list as far as ET's are concerned? They were a bit limited in availability to about 4500 in 1 year of production, and I honestly don't think it has much of an advantage (other than Hp rating) over a a L-78 Nova? I happen to know of a '69 L-78 Nova, headers slick and re-curved dist and it was an 11.70 car back in 1969. PLUS it was available for 3 years (68-70) and was a bunch cheaper then the LS-6.

Is this not exactly the reason Don Yenko waited for a COPO version of the Nova 427 before he would jump in with a YSC version? Curb weight of a SS396 Nova 4sp "on-line" is 3370 as posted here:

http://www.automobile-catalog.com/ma...e_ss/1969.html




Curb weight of a 1970 SS454 4sp LS-6 is 3743 as posted on the same site:

http://www.automobile-catalog.com/ma...e_ss/1970.html

So a 396 Nova would be 378 lbs lighter and we all know the L-78 can run HARD as well.

Therefore, I really think the SS396 Nova we the actual street KING. ET wise, there were very hard to beat, available for 3 years with hi compression, and low buck so more could afford them.

Then you can talk about the COPO 427 Nova's!!!! Only the Zl-1 and the A990/'68 Hemi cars could run with that beast.

X2 on 69 Nova L78!!!