Street Outlaws on Discovery....

[Craig_Maiorana]

well said Old 5.0 ... Their fees are also so inflated all the way around that whether racing at an event or even just attending will break your bank. I don't know how some of these grass roots guys can afford to do it even at a weekend racer level. I just think the suits that run the NHRA have lost touch with what Wally Parks started it as. I get the taking the racers off of the streets, but what they do on the show is not like what you see at say the Compton street races where the sidelines are filled with people just waiting to be run down by an out of control car. Despite the "staged" aspect or the fact that it is reality TV show I think the NHRA has overstepped their boundaries on this one. When you have guys like Lutz saying go ahead pull my license it shows that people really are fed up with their money machine mentality.

[YENKO DEUCE REGISTRY]

"78 Sedan deVille to run V/Stock.... their arrogance is exactly why they're on ESPN 47 getting preempted by professional women's curling...."

That's funny! [img]<<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/biggthumpup.gif[/img]

[cook_dw]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: old5.0</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: YENKO DEUCE REGISTRY</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: old5.0</div><div class="ubbcode-body">NHRA is in it to get paid. What have they done over the past thirty or forty years to fulfill this sacred mission of theirs? What have they done to support grassroots racers, encourage young people to enter the hobby, or substantively change the public's perception of drag racing?</div></div>

I'm not supporting NHRA's action against the SO participants, but I would have to object a bit on the statement above - the Jr Dragster class has been the fastest (and within the last 4-5 years, the only) growing class within the NHRA - us included. So, while they have not really catered to the Jr's, they have created the class, set (sometimes 'silly') rules, organized 2 National Jr Dragster Events each year, and recently have allowed a handful of Jr's to run during NHRA National events. So, on that front, they have done well. They continue to struggle with converting Jr racers to big cars, but that is true in just about every sport with a 'feeder group'.

I do like the SO show, I watch it with my sons, and I point out their controlled environment and that it is against the law to street race - we enjoy the competitive nature of the participants, the smack talk and the calling out process. I'll take SO over the new 'Karting' show any day.... </div></div>

That's true, they do support the juniors and I should have acknowledged that. My problem, though, is what happens after you graduate out of the Jr. ranks.

I had a discussion about this on another forum sometime back, but it's relevant here, as well. NHRA is declining in relevance, and they've done it to themselves simply because they thought they were the only game in town. Back in the 80's, you could see it coming. They were already marginalizing the grass roots racers that put them on the map in favor of the Pro classes, but then the NMCA popped up and, concurrently, as the 5.0 Mustang got rolling, you began seeing small shootout series like the 5.0 vs. GN races, and finally a 5.0-only sanctioning body, the AMRA, was formed in about '89 or '90. The impetus behind this was easy to figure out; I could by new Mustang, H/C/I swap and a blower and have a driveable 9-second street car. On top of that, I could head to an AMRA race and participate in some good old-fashioned, heads-up, run-what-ya-brung drag racing.

Or, I could go to NHRA and spend a bunch of money on a 78 Sedan deVille to run V/Stock because that particular car hadn't been hit with a massive horsepower factor yet and I might stand a fighting chance of winning a hundred bucks for my trouble. That's an easy decision in my book.

It would have been so simple for the NHRA to provide a home for all the young people who were part of the emerging heads-up revolution back then. Revive a dead class designation like Factory Experimental or Modified Production for the late-models, and another for the vintage musclecar guys who didn't want to be restricted by the existing Stock-S/S rules. No factors, no weight breaks, no BS; whoever hits the stripe first wins. Everything from the Pure Stock drags to big tire grudge style racing could have existed wholly under the NHRA banner (as opposed to just racing at NHRA sanctioned tracks), which would have provided all drag racers with truly unified front that might have been more effective in actually accomplishing goals like getting kids off the street and keeping tracks open. But that isn't what they did, and the landscape of drag racing has been completely altered because of it. NHRA thought they <span style="font-style: italic">owned</span> drag racing. But they were wrong, and their arrogance is exactly why they're on ESPN 47 getting preempted by professional women's curling.

NHRA is killing itself slowly, a self-imposed death by a thousand cuts. Ten thousand stupid little decisions adding up to a massive problem (not coincidentally, unless something has changed, don't they refuse to acknowledge that your Deuce even exists?). I suppose my biggest problem is that in my mind, I can't square NHRA's actions with incompetence, not completely. Which is why I said they're in it to get paid. They want to squeeze as much money as possible out of as many people as possible for as long as possible. I just don't see any other reasonable explanation for their actions, although maybe I'm reading too much into it and they really are as shortsighted as they appear. Ultimately, I suspect this entire mess with SO has less to do with street racing and more to do with (as someone on another forum so aptly put it) the fact that a primered Nova from Oklahoma has twice as many Facebook likes as they do.
</div></div>

Couldnt have said it better. Well done.

[Craig_Maiorana]

This is exactly the intelligent reply I was looking for. I wanted to pick the brains of pure dirt under the fingernail car guys. I agree whole heartedly with this. The NHRA is pushing itself into extinction and the fact that real working class car guys see it as well makes me feel a lot better. My own interest has been dissipating over the past few years. I used to never miss a race both on TV and out at Pomona. I have now neglected to go to the past 2 because I just don't feel that my &quot;Entertainment Dollar&quot; is being taken seriously. It's no longer run on 1320' It's 60 bucks at the gate and now on sunday at Pomona they are done before 4 pm because of all of the lousy neighbors that live around the track. So is it worth it for me to spend 120.00 for 1 day for my wife and I to go and watch some hum drum pro cars run or is it a better idea to go to Fontana and watch real cars run for 10 to 20 bucks or got to the street car super nats in vegas for 100 for 2 of us for 2 days and watch real cars and exciting runs. I'd rather spend my money on the real cars than watch these cookie cutters fade away into obscurity.

[earntaz]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: YENKO DEUCE REGISTRY</div><div class="ubbcode-body">&quot;78 Sedan deVille to run V/Stock.... their arrogance is exactly why they're on ESPN 47 getting preempted by professional women's curling....&quot;

That's funny! [img]<<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/biggthumpup.gif[/img]</div></div>

Now that's funny!

But the bottom line here is glorifying street racing -- yes, most of us have done it in some manner. But some, including youngin's that are watching this get the impression it is OK to go out and street bash -- we know that's wrong. In the past here in Texas if you were caught and convicted of a &quot;contest of speed&quot; you could loose your ride!

The local track here is San Antonio Raceway (very nice facility) and it appears it is in the process of closing the door. There were many, including myself who enjoyed the racing and &quot;test &amp; tune&quot; sessions in a legal and controlled environment.

IMHO all sanctioning bodies (NHRA. IHRA, etc.) need to make racing and test &amp; tune sessions a bit more affordable -- just that will give the smart street racers a place to do their thing.

TAZ

[Craig_Maiorana]

Not only that. These sanctioning bodies need to give back to these tracks. Help them keep their gates open. Out here in California they are trying to resurrect the old brothers raceway on terminal island. A run what you brung track for the people and by the people.

[old5.0]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SMOKIN_JOKER</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Not only that. These sanctioning bodies need to give back to these tracks. Help them keep their gates open. Out here in California they are trying to resurrect the old brothers raceway on terminal island. A run what you brung track for the people and by the people. </div></div>

The problem is that NHRA is doing exactly the opposite. I understand they've been threatening to pull the sanction from tracks that allow outlaw and grudge style racing. Doesn't quite fit with the &quot;NHRA wants to stop street racing&quot; meme, but goes well with my &quot;NHRA wants their cut of the action&quot; theory. Sending threatening letters to Murillo\Lutz\Andrade, et al, isn't new behavior on the part of the NHRA, but it blew up in their face because these guys decided to go public.

Anyway, I'm not condoning street racing; it is dangerous and that's why I don't do it anymore. My outrage has less to do with street racing and more to do with the NHRA's hypocrisy. That said, I do enjoy the show and I'm looking forward to next week. I've been jonesing to see Chief's Goat and Murillo's notch get down for a while now.

[Pulnaway]

Murillo won't be giving up his NHRA license. He has a show coming out soon called The house of grudge. He needs the NHRA tracks to make his show happen.

[old5.0]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Pulnaway</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Murillo won't be giving up his NHRA license. He has a show coming out soon called The house of grudge. He needs the NHRA tracks to make his show happen.
</div></div>

You're exactly right, he won't give it up. He isn't going to start a war with the NHRA because he's smart and he knows he'll lose. All he needed to do was what he did: post the letter on Facebook, sit on the fence and let the public react. It's worked fairly well so far, since the opinion of the racing community seems to be overwhelmingly against the NHRA. With the pending lawsuit (which has been eerily silent since it was filed), rumors of some sort of sale and tracks being threatened privately, my guess is that there's a lot more going on behind the scenes in Glendora than we're aware of and this little public feud with a popular television show is the last thing they wanted. I've known Murillo by rep for 20 or more years, and this wouldn't the be first time he's played the long game with a sanctioning body.

[YENKO DEUCE REGISTRY]

Lawsuit meaning the challenge to NHRA's 501c3 Not for Profit status?

BTW, Tom Compton (CEO of NHRA) reported annual total compensation in the 2012 Form 990 of $709K! This comp for an organization with total revenue of just under $100M, it's no wonder they are a bit protective of the golden goose.