BE COPO rear for sale??
 

looks pretty bad to me you can be the judge
https://southjersey.craigslist.org/pts/6068741507.html

Printed for posterity.
Original 69 Chevrolet Camaro 427 COPO 12 bolt rear end. This is an original BE rear end that was in a race car for many years. Currently has 4.56 gears with spool, Moser axles, and c-clip eliminators. Casting date is D-11-9. Assembly date is BE 0416G2. Will need original spring pads installed and ladder bar brackets cut off to go back into an original car. This is a must have for any original COPO or Yenko 427 car. $5500. 609-320-8025 Matt. No texts.

It's common to see the marks in the area where the axle code is but, I wouldn't think the BE would still be so clean... Looks like a bad re-stamp to me. Not even similar fonts to an original axle code.

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I am very skeptical.

Sorry, not "buying" it...

I don't have any BE rears with that date. I do have BL rears with that date though.

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looks like D 11 9 cast date. are you saying that it was a BV or it's a '68 BE?

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This rear belongs to a member here with a spotless reputation. This rear was posted here when he located it at englishtown. There are a few dates of BE rears that were factory reworked.

Are you asking us to believe that you can make out a remnant of a V out of all those marks around the re-stamp? You must have better eyes than my 20/15. Why would GM use a different font to re-stamp them? Is there somewhere else we can confirm your claim about BVs being restamped? Haven't heard that one before. Do you have any pics as examples we can see?
I think BL restamped is more likely, but even then the stamp is so bad...

The rear in question the day it was found

I've seen that pic. Definitely doesn't change my opinion.

This thread should probably be deleted completely to keep this info quiet otherwise there will soon be more "original" reworked BE rears than you can shake a stick at.

Good call Mike, I deleted any info I posted.

Lol...

Does anyone have any contacts or former employees from Detroit Axle & Gear that may remember the late 60's?


As for the stamp.. I am torn.

The community is pretty astute about BE stamps. When a BV is changed to a BE (
today or from the factory) - the value obviously drops off considerably. also, most if not all of the original BE assembly dates are known. It is an interesting discussion though. I'm not doubting the story, just trying to make sense out of it. Why in the world would a BV rear be re-stamped to BE due to a lack of BE "parts". It would have to be the heat treated copo gears right? So, how does that make sense? If you're out of the BE specific components, and you decide to substitute BV components - why not just make a new BE rear using BV components? Why go to the trouble of taking an already assembled BV and changing the V to a E? Or maybe you're saying that it wasn't a parts shortage - the factory just made an error in stamping a real BE as a BV?

The whole thing makes no sense, but then again - I was the poor student at the Tonawanda foundry who spent a few days whacking part numbers on castings that were cast with partial part numbers missing! At the time, I didn't think that made much sense either.

Im not disagreeing that the community is aware of the stampings.. I am more interested in if there was a stamping error how was it resolved. In the case of the engine or trans stamps they were either "x" out, stamped over (if the stamp was too light the first go around) or it was left unchanged.. I have my thoughts about the diff in question but I am not going to voice an opinion at this time.

My 69 Z/28 was a race car for many decades and the original housing was still in it. With the perches moved a couple times, ladder bar brackets welded on and all of the twisting it had over the years, the thing was looking like a boomerang if you know what I mean.

Numbers were no longer on the tube to be seen as the ladder bar brackets went over the build date numbers with any welds or grinding marks left to take care of any other remnants on the old stamp. Housing was so bent up that I simply sold it for the parts it had in it. The rest was considered junk and looked just like the subject diff does in this post. I think I got $1000 for the sum of it in parts given it had race disks, a spool, HD yoke and an Ultimate cover. The rest in my opinion was worthless after being hacked up, ground and welded upon. I don't know how any original stamp could survive that, and if its twisted as mine was, the value is in the toilet IMHO. :)

http://i1218.photobucket.com/albums/...s/IMG_0999.jpg

I saw the ad on craigslist and I know the owner Matt and have bought parts from him.

Hid reputation as a parts vendor is impecable. I'd bet that this rear is real BE...

Just for clarification.... I'm not questioning his reputation. I'm questioning the rear end. An honest man can be mistaken or mislead by others telling them what's real and what's "Memorex." When there is as much money involved as what he's asking and is obviously a re-stamp (legit or not), he better be ready for the vetting that should come with it.

If you wanted to save it bad enough it could be fixed. I am going to widen a few 12 bolts I have back to stock width. As for the rear in question Matt knows his stuff and it does have a value. He lives in one of the old drag race hot beds. Those parts are still floating around. I got a 69 ZL1 block from a sprint car driver. Matts 68 Z was picked apart when he put it on Ebay. It was a real car. Mistakes can be made but if HE questioned it he would have it in the add. I found it funny when I had a 69 302 CE engine on Craigslist and found it as a topic on one of the sites. Research, be diligent. If it's not for you don't buy it

Yes. I could have welded in new tubes, added a posi carrier, gear set and changed out the pinion and the brakes, but with the numbers gone what would the purpose be? It was easier (and cheaper) to buy a complete dated diff rather than restore the twisted original 12 bolt that was modified for Super Stock.

That's why the value of mine was in the toilet. Just saying.:dunno:

I'm not saying that I would bet on Matt's reputation either. I'm sure he is not going by 'someone's Memorex'. I'd bet on the fact that he knows parts better than 99.999% of us !! Also he knows the situation when he bought the rear also.

I've bought many shop meet parts and have a real good idea if the guys story is BS or not. Sometimes you just know. ABout 10 years ago,I bought a BE rear at a swap meet for regular 12 bolt price. It was just a Camaro 4:10 12 bolt posi according to the seller. I'm no expert on these rears, (especially back then). But the fact that he sold the rear so cheap proved to me that there was no reason to restamp the rear.

I'll be the first to say that anything is possible, I remember when I bought a rear for my ZL-1, I found out that some COPO's have rears actually dated after the cowl date of the cars.

Unfortunately, there are known 'supposedly legit' cars, motors/trans/rears and stamps etc. that are actually excellent fakes. And legit stamps that are considered fake.



Unfortunately, this may be one of them parts that because it does not meet the 'norm', will never be accepted by the majority as legit. whether it is or not.

I couldn't agree more that anything is possible. What a find for you at the swap meet finding that BE. That's incredible. Admittedly, the only thing I'm going off of are the pics in this thread. My opinion doesn't really matter. The only two that matter are his and the person that he's selling it too. You know what they say about opinions: "They're like aholes. Everyone's got one and they all stink...".

I've been to the Englishtown swap meet many times starting back in the '80s. The place was full of used race car parts. I was buying Schwinn bikes out of there for pennies on the dollar because only a few guys knew what they were worth and we all worked with each other. Aluminum heads, narrowed rears (I'm sure more BEs than this one), 4-speeds.....the place was ripe with good stuff if you knew your shit. This rear has more ink than " Fitty Cent" .

I'd like to thank the few people in this thread that defended this rear end and my reputation as a seller. Thank you guys. This rear is 100% real and legitimate and can be backed up with other known stamps that look similar to mine. COPO's were sold as factory race cars and these cars usually went through multiple stages of modifications to keep up with ever changing NHRA rules. Honestly, who would restamp this rear end on a housing that's had so many modifications and then paint it with multiple layers of paint and professionally age it and sell it to me for a modified 12 bolt price at a random swap meet? It doesn't make any sense. It came out of the Spring Englishtown swap meet last year. It was just an old race car rear end to the guy that I got it from who was back halfing his car. This is Yenko.net, and it is advertised here, which comes with a 100% guarantee of authenticity or your money back.

-Matt

Couldn't agree more Matt. I don't think we've done any business, but your reputation is impeccable. I'd have tried to talk him into a look at the car, and try to buy that, too. Good chance it would've been a COPO.

After looking at it in its "as found" condition, I certainly believe what you are saying Matt. The "BE" looked good to me. How did you determine the assembly date?

The assembly date on the rear end housing? 0416G2. April 16th. I don't know the assembly date of the car.

I was asking how you figured out that 0416G2 was the actual assembly date. It looked like that part of the stamp was gone prior to the repairs.

There was nothing welded over the stamping, it's just rusty marks from a U bolt. It was perfectly fine under the paint.

I see it now - thanks

I suspected that was the situation when you bought this rear Matt... Exactly my point...why restamp a butchered up rear?? 100% REAL !!

Thanks guys for the publicity, rear has been sold to a member here.

-Matt

Congrats on the sale and the buyer. :beers:

Just to recap.. the negative comments about my BE rear in this thread lost me my sale, so thanks to that for the people who have no clue when it comes to rare parts like this. It was just recently brought to my attention by another member here that I have the same exact rear as another COPO currently listed for sale. Just a heads up to all the naysayers... here is a DOCUMENTED COPO that has the same exact rear end date code and assembly stamping.

https://www.yenko.net/forum/showthread.php?t=144521

https://www.yenko.net/forum/attachmen...1&d=1505774913
https://www.yenko.net/forum/attachmen...1&d=1506887780

If my comments attributed to your loss of sale, I truly apologize. I just read back through the thread and only see a reasonable discussion though questioning something that didn't look right. Uneducated on the specific subject as the opinions might have been, I stated that it was just my opinion based on what I was seeing in the pic. I'm sure my words aren't going to fix anything, but I do apologize if I screwed something up for you.