Re: 69 Z28 RS JL8 Crossram car listed at BJ auctio
 

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I have been hearing for the last 3-4 years that the market is going to drop. Sort of like predicting the long range weather, keep saying the same thing long enough and sooner or later you will be right. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...ns/naughty.gif

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Well, I sold my real 1971 HemiCuda Convertible (the yellow one) to Otis Chandler back in 1987 for $54,000 because I thought the market had peeked. ...I guess I was wrong (It's a 2.5 million dollar car now) At least I kept my 70 Charger.

The morale of the story is: if you like it, buy it and keep it to enjoy yourself. That way you cant go wrong. If the value goes up or down you still have the car you liked to begin with. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...ns/scholar.gif

Re: 69 Z28 RS JL8 Crossram car listed at BJ auctio
 

$68,000 for the yellow '66 Vette 300hp powerglide seems outrageous to me.

Re: 69 Z28 RS JL8 Crossram car listed at BJ auctio
 

Jeff, The Orange car had a non-GM crossram, was originally green, NOM DZ302, quarter panels installed crooked, etc. Wolf in sheeps clothing. Don't think it was as good of car as my Garnet Z with the non-GM crossram that went for 30K less on ebay last week although it was probably "prepped" for auction better.

Re: 69 Z28 RS JL8 Crossram car listed at BJ auctio
 

That's what I thought about the Orange car. $79K for a NOM non GM crossram Z28. I can't figure it out. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...s/confused.gif

Re: 69 Z28 RS JL8 Crossram car listed at BJ auctio
 

Without coming off negative I did not say it last night.....the Motion Vette Brought $210,000!!!!! I predicted it would not do over 200K......I guess the market is changing........

Re: 69 Z28 RS JL8 Crossram car listed at BJ auctio
 

Yeah, that was a stunner. These guys paying $500K for a street rod but nobody is stepping up for the rare muscle. I'm confused. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...s/confused.gif

Re: 69 Z28 RS JL8 Crossram car listed at BJ auctio
 

In my opinion, very few bidders there know anything about COPOs, Motion cars or other truely rare muscle cars. They want something to look pretty sitting in their garage. I'm not saying the COPOs aren't nice looking cars. Most of them look like a plain jane car until you open the hood. That's not what most of these guys want. They would rather spend $500K on one of Boyd's street rods that will be worth $100K in a few years.
James

Re: 69 Z28 RS JL8 Crossram car listed at BJ auctio
 

Have to admit that some of those customs are pretty sweet. I did like that "Whatthehea" Boyd car. Some of those woodys were done very nicely. The silver woody gave me a, well you know. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...ns/naughty.gif

Re: 69 Z28 RS JL8 Crossram car listed at BJ auctio
 

I guess if the Dellahaye/What-the-haye was a truck, it would have been called the "What-the-F--k https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...ns/naughty.gif

Re: 69 Z28 RS JL8 Crossram car listed at BJ auctio
 

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These guys paying $500K for a street rod but nobody is stepping up for the rare muscle. I'm confused.

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It's probably because the ultra-dollar street rods are truly one-of-a-kind but there's always some other guy out there with a Hemi Cuda or LS6 convert.

Re: 69 Z28 RS JL8 Crossram car listed at BJ auctio
 

Some of those creations were simply mind boggling...someone brought a just completed Boydster (whatever that is) and it went for 90k...bet it cost more to build it...

Re: 69 Z28 RS JL8 Crossram car listed at BJ auctio
 

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Have to admit that some of those customs are pretty sweet. I did like that "Whatthehay" Boyd car.....

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That car was absolutely stunning. The only problem is after seeing Boyd's TV show, I know the BS craftmanship that went into building that thing. Brock Yates is talking about how people are paying the big dollars for Boyd's cars because of his exceptional craftmanship when in reality, his cars are built by a bunch of cry baby 20 year olds.

Re: 69 Z28 RS JL8 Crossram car listed at BJ auction
 

THIS WAS MY FIRST YEAR AT BJ I TOOK THE BLUE JL-8 WITH THE CROSSRAM. I CAN SAY MY CAR WAS ONE OF THE NICEST Z-28S THERE AND BY FAR THE MOST ORIGINAL. I CANNOT UNDERSTAND HOW A CAR WITH A REPRO CROSSRAM AND OTHER NON ORIGINAL PEICES CAN SELL OF 70 TO 90K. I BOUGHT MY CAR BACK FROM BARRETT-JACKSON. I FEEL LIKE THE AUCTION DID NOT WORK THE CAR FOR THE $ IT IS WORTH, MOST OF THE Z-28S THERE WERE NOT THE CALIBUR OF MY MY CAR IN OPINION. 16K IS A LOT OF $ FOR 2 MINUTES OF ACTION. I ASSUME THEY HAVE HAVE NOT POSTED MY CAR AS SOLD BECAUSE I HAVE NOT PAID THE 16K COMMISSION.

Re: 69 Z28 RS JL8 Crossram car listed at BJ auction
 

Sorry the car didn't bring what you were hoping it would. I can't figure it out. Cars with non original motor and modified Offenhauser crossram gets $79K but your car with all rare GM parts and original motor only goes up to $100K. I just don't get it. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/dunno.gif

Re: 69 Z28 RS JL8 Crossram car listed at BJ auction
 

I think a few people got less for their cars than anticipated,some will be unwilling to gamble if they continue with no reserve.The format last year was better for sellers who had the option of lowering the reserve during the auction,but it is decidedly anticlimactic for viewers so it doesn't seem likely to change

On the bright side Muscle is the future of this auction https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...s/headbang.gif

Re: 69 Z28 RS JL8 Crossram car listed at BJ auction
 

Some people say the bubble will burst. I kind of doubt it because the people who are buying now can hold on to them through thick and thin. My dream hemi car is turning into a nightmare...why didn't I buy ten years ago....oh, I remember...I couldn't justify what they were bringing even then! Idiot!

Re: 69 Z28 RS JL8 Crossram car listed at BJ auction
 

Don't you hate when you're behind the price curve! I wanted to buy a beach house on Long Beach Island here in NJ and I was sooooo close about 7 years ago. Now the curve has headed upwards so fast I doubt it will ever happen.

Re: 69 Z28 RS JL8 Crossram car listed at BJ auction
 

Patience http://www.clipart-directory.com/gfi...loon-burst.gif

Re: 69 Z28 RS JL8 Crossram car listed at BJ auction
 

The prices have not sky rocked to the point of unaffordable.
It's been that way for a long time. 1969 I lived in Burlington,Ia 40 miles from Fred Gibb. The ZL-1 were 7,800 dollars, then I couldn't afford one and 12-31-02 I was their for the new 2002 Camaro ZL-1 and I still can't afford one so nothing has changed. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/beers.gif

Re: 69 Z28 RS JL8 Crossram car listed at BJ auction
 

Kim, I too would have bought a ZL1. Didn't have the brains. Bought an 02 GMMG ZL1 in which I will soon have $150k invested (bad choice of words). Which proves I still have no brains!!! https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/no.gif

Yep, got carried away. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/dunno.gif

Re: 69 Z28 RS JL8 Crossram car listed at BJ auction
 

So it seems that in an investment standpoint your better off to comission a high end builder to build a one off ride and bring it to barrett jackson to unload it to a rich image consious guy than to put your money into rare muscle. You can't tell me that the Zephyr from last year, whatthehaye and the teraplane (which was built by the same guys as last years zehpyr) from this year cost that much to build. They must have made a tidy profit on both, even the stupid Alumitub (how many more stupid names can they come up with) got more money than i thought, look at the reproduction mercedes gullwing reaching nearly original prices??. Even the guy who thought he would maximize on last year Zephyr and brought that covertable one only went for $60k. There was some good prices paid from some nice build projects and i would think most those guys were happy. The 35 ford roadster tucci build went for 70k and i know he wanted $200k late last year becouse i talked to him, so OWWW!, i would think he bought that back. I wonder how many others bought theirs back?. I wasent there but some of those custom rods were very nice (Bruce?), and seemed to be getting top dollor. The commentators were mentioning that cars like chevzoom still got all the money and it's a 15 yr old car and yet they said it will be a future collectable becouse it's a Boydd build and yet the foose Stueddy and the Skyliner did'nt hit the right marks (the realmad seemed about the right price). Yet Foose is in my opinion the superior builder??????. The crowd there seemed to be looking for nice cars not nessasarly "right" cars. I like how in some cases the wife is in the bidders ear. BTW, craig's comment on the 3mill olds was he sold that car to it's current owner back in 97 and he said he would be happy if it brought 600-700k. He must be doing backflips!!!!

Re: 69 Z28 RS JL8 Crossram car listed at BJ auctio
 

I was there this weekend and watched all the cars that went across Thursday-Sunday. There were some nice honest cars there, like the blue 69 RS-Z and the blue 68 Z, but there was some real crap too.

Bottom line: If you see a car associated with Mark Young (aka Chev Connection) and/or Ressler (the yellow jacket guy), then run away.

Young was back with his bogus brown 68 L89 because he was forced to take it back last year, then promptly pawned it off to another unsuspecting buyer.

IMO, the Chev world needs the equivalent of a Galen Glovier to provide some semblance of policing for these crooks.

P.S.: The Coddington and Foose cars were all outstanding. I even got to meet Duh-Wayne from Boyd's shop -- he's taller in real life, you know. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/smile.gif

Re: 69 Z28 RS JL8 Crossram car listed at BJ auction
 

"BTW, craig's comment on the 3mill olds was he sold that car to it's current owner back in 97 and he said he would be happy if it brought 600-700k. He must be doing backflips!!!!"

If thats how Craig expresses his anger. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/smirk.gif
He probably wishes he kept that car now & he was the seller of it Saturday.

Re: 69 Z28 RS JL8 Crossram car listed at BJ auction
 

No i meant that the current owner was saying he would be happy with 600-700k.

Re: 69 Z28 RS JL8 Crossram car listed at BJ auction
 

I wouldn't put a lot on money in a car that I wouldn't be happy with for a long, long time. My 02 ZL1 will not be worth anywhere near what I will have in it until I am long gone. If ever. But, I love the late model SS body style and need to see one everyday. I guess that's why I have a black, 1LE SS on a lift in my garage. I like to drive it but even if I didn't I would still have to have it.

The supercharged C5R 427 ZL1 will be virtually useless on the street but I still want it. It's kind of like looking under the hood of a hemi. If someone has to ask why you are glass eyed, mesmerized and drooling after an hour or so don't even bother trying to explain it to them. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...s/rolleyes.gif

Re: 69 Z28 RS JL8 Crossram car listed at BJ auction
 

Jay Leno qoute "collect what brings you happiness"

Re: 69 Z28 RS JL8 Crossram car listed at BJ auction
 

In collecting (coins, guns, cars, etc.) if you are in it for the money then eventually you will lose and lose big...I think the current prices and what sold for big money at B/J (the tri-fives, vintage t-birds, Shelby's, 'vettes, some rods, and hemis) represent what the "non-enthuiast" feels are collectibles. These are the cars that the average lay person thinks about when you mention "collector car." These cars have always been collectible and sought after. They aren't the "envogue" cars..ala "supercars" (no disrespect to anyone...) or specualtive cars. These are the cars that have ALWAYS brought good money. The JL8 cars, crossrams, Motions, etc. are all nice cars, but the hobby isn't really driven too much by niche pricing...It is usually driven and more importantly substained by what the "average joe" thinks. Ask your average car collector or enthusiast what type of Camaro they liek and most will say a "Z28" not a Yenko or Motion, ask an enthusiast to pick a Corvette and a lot will say a "split window"..not a 1 of 10 Motion car. These speciality cars are always going to be desirable and collectible, but they are a lot more volatile to pricing swings. I have never been into the heavily specualated cars, having concertrated on owning more "generic" cars..L78's, Z's, LS6's, 440x6, etc. I think these cars won't hurt a buyer nearly as much as the "supercars" (Yenkos, hemis, Motions, etc.) as evidence by the fact the Z's were bringing almost 2/3rds of what COPO's were. The plain fact of the matter is that it is the websites like this (a great site and one which there is a wealth of info, but also one which has largely been responsible for people asking 200k for a COPO with stripes..) that have over inflated certain cars and as collectors and specualtors bail out these will be the cars that get hit the hardest. I for one hope the bubble burst and burst big.. Just my opinion.

Re: 69 Z28 RS JL8 Crossram car listed at BJ auction
 

remember what site you are posting to, the "supercar" registry. this is what these folks are into, although we love the other muscle also. the bubble may burst one day, just say goodbye to all the fine cars we are seeing for sale today they will be tucked away and not seen for sale again until that bubble reinflates, then 10 ,or 20 years down the road you can imagine the prices they'll bring then

Re: 69 Z28 RS JL8 Crossram car listed at BJ auction
 

I'm well aware of the website I'm posting to...I am only pointing out what a lot of people already know..When a group hypes a certain marque and the cars are sold amongst themselves, thereby creating a "ghost" market sooner or later the bubble burst, and the cars come back to what the actual value is. There are a lot of very knowledgable people here, but conversely there are a lot of the same people that for the last 3 years have been hyping the Yenkos, COPO's, and the like and artifically inflating the market. If the market wasn't inflated then there wouldn't be discussion of collectors having to buy their car back at auction. Case in point the blue/RS Z..I have not personally seen the car, but have no doubt it is a superb car..Is it worth more than what the seller had to pay to buy it back. IMHO no..if it was then there wouldn't have been a need to buy it back in the first place. The mainstream would have recognized the value and the car would have sold. Especially given that the auction draws people from all over the world, and is well regard (rightly or wrongly) as the premier auction for classic cars. If we agree that the rarer, higher horepower cars are always going to be collectible at what point do we take into account the people that most likely will substain their prices not buying anymore. Do you guys really feel that the musclecar as we define it will be collectible in 20 years and more importantly will the rate of appreciation be on par with the time factor? This is not only a problem here but a problem elsewhere in the hobby as well.

Re: 69 Z28 RS JL8 Crossram car listed at BJ auctio
 

these cars as well as others have been creeping in price every year. the yenkos, copos, motions, zl1s and on and on deserve "hyping" these are special automobiles as we all know the reasons behind what makes these cars what they are. this type of thing goes on in every car maker "high end" market, you have it in porsche, ferrari, corvette, etc. etc. no one is artifically inflating any markets, the simple facts are those that were young in that era that could only dream of those cars then, are now well to do and are purchasing that car they always held dear in thier hearts as a young boy growing up irregardless of price, thats whats driving the market, people are richer today, lots of money been made in the last 20 years, why? the world wide web is a major contributing factor. the blue jl8 z had some issues, i'm not saying the bj auction is a gauge or anything, its an auction, its design is to get the heart pumping, as i'm sure everyones aware. i would enjoy telling that i bought it at scottsdale to my friends. yes i think the musclecar as we define it will always be collectible, its a day gone buy never to return again in the form it was back then,your major manufactorers are all trying to duplicate it today, and doing a good job doing it imo.

Re: 69 Z28 RS JL8 Crossram car listed at BJ auctio
 

Here's another $.02 worth. SOME old cars are like beachfront property. They ain't and can't make any more. Which of the old ones are BF and which are non-commercial farm property??? We all have our opinions on that and I think we would all agree on certain American cars; most hemis, ZL1s, COPOs, Cobras, Shelbys, Yenkos etc. And, which of the current muscle cars, if any, will reach collector status in the future? Who knows how market forces, fuel prices and even political and cultural shifts will effect the mkt. in 15-20 years?

Re: 69 Z28 RS JL8 Crossram car listed at BJ auction
 

Greg..interesting observations and opinions....More the view of someone who would rather not have Yenkos/COPO cars and thats great...As the value of the much rarer and sought after Supercars go...so goes the Z28's the LS6's,L78,440 +6,etc.

Re: 69 Z28 RS JL8 Crossram car listed at BJ auction
 

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Greg..interesting observations and opinions....More the view of someone who would rather not have Yenkos/COPO cars and thats great...As the value of the much rarer and sought after Supercars go...so goes the Z28's the LS6's,L78,440 +6,etc.

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In addition to the escalating prices that the "lesser" musclecars will experience as the more sought after cars move out of the reach of most people I think that the clone cars will become more accepted by the collector family. I know I've always dreamed of owning a 1969 GT-500 like my parents owned when I was a kid but, since that will never happen unless I win the lottery, I might have to settle for owning a clone of that car. Even building a clone of your dream car is no cheap proposition which is why I think they will bring some big bucks once all of the real deal "supercars" are all locked up in the museums and collections never to be seen or driven again. (That will be a sad day indeed when these cars are looked upon as too valuable to enjoy).

Re: 69 Z28 RS JL8 Crossram car listed at BJ auction
 

I heard an orange 69 Yenko Camaro "clone" sold for nearly 90K at B-J this weekend. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...emlins/eek.gif

Re: 69 Z28 RS JL8 Crossram car listed at BJ auction
 

I believe quality cars will always be in high demand, yes rarity makes them more desirable. One quality 68 Z with good pedigree brought I believe 69K at BJ(that was Yenko money a few short years ago). That has to be close to a record. Conversely mediocre cars I think have been most effected (downward)by what I observed at BJ and private sales. I am not saying that we are in a bubble or not, I don't care. I keep hearing the "hobbyist" state they are waiting for the bubble to burst...is that not speculating, on the speculators.

Re: 69 Z28 RS JL8 Crossram car listed at BJ auction
 

I can't imagine not driving these cars...even if its only to local cruises....take a trip to SCR8 and you can watch them race as they were intended !!!

Re: 69 Z28 RS JL8 Crossram car listed at BJ auction
 

I'm going to try my hardest to get out to SCR8...now THAT would be cool!!! https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...iggthumpup.gif


I haven't been back to Illinois since the summer of '73...

And yes...I'd bring my camera! https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/beers.gif

Re: 69 Z28 RS JL8 Crossram car listed at BJ auction
 

For third year in a row I'm going to TRY to go too!

Re: 69 Z28 RS JL8 Crossram car listed at BJ auction
 

It's worth it...these guys thrash the hell out of their cars... https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...ins/3gears.gif

Re: 69 Z28 RS JL8 Crossram car listed at BJ auction
 

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I believe quality cars will always be in high demand, yes rarity makes them more desirable. One quality 68 Z with good pedigree brought I believe 69K at BJ(that was Yenko money a few short years ago). That has to be close to a record. Conversely mediocre cars I think have been most effected (downward)by what I observed at BJ and private sales. I am not saying that we are in a bubble or not, I don't care. I keep hearing the "hobbyist" state they are waiting for the bubble to burst...is that not speculating, on the speculators.

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https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...iggthumpup.gif