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Re: 1970 L78 NOVA SS 396 4-SPEED DOCUMENTED
Pics or ban.... https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...ns/naughty.gif
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Re: 1970 L78 NOVA SS 396 4-SPEED DOCUMENTED
Seems like the boys on Steve's are following this car also..last post is very interesting.... https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/hmmm.gif
http://www.stevesnovasite.com/forums...ad.php?t=61730 wilma |
Re: 1970 L78 NOVA SS 396 4-SPEED DOCUMENTED
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Now that I do not, or will not want to get into, like I said, I haven't seen the car SINCE JIM OWNED it. And on that note, HE was told, or told us that the original motor had broke the block and a rod though it, and eventually scraped. Therefore this motor was built in it's place. Much like my '69 396/350 car with a '72 402 built to 375hp specs. [/ QUOTE ] Sure would like to see those pics that were supposedly sent of a motor that was windowed and scrapped....and now it turns up again in 2 places....Mr G can you post them hereif they were sent to you so we can all see rather than just hear peoples claims ? If its restamped then just admit it and lower the price. It would be nice to put this to rest. |
Re: 1970 L78 NOVA SS 396 4-SPEED DOCUMENTED
Im curious why 3 people would team up on a guy in 3 different internet forums to discredit him for all to see , and when asked for proof they send HIM the "picture" . Who saves a windowed 396 for 20 years anyway and doesnt give it wirh the car if they think its important enough to save in the first place ????? maybe the person that claims he has the original block can sell it to the current owner and they will both benefit.
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Re: 1970 L78 NOVA SS 396 4-SPEED DOCUMENTED
427king:
I'm with you on this one. Why didn't an L78 Original Block go with the documented L78 Nova? I think both sides of this thing are %!##%**! Just my .02 https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/bs.gif Ed |
Re: 1970 L78 NOVA SS 396 4-SPEED DOCUMENTED
It has become more of a biz and less of a hobby each day.
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Re: 1970 L78 NOVA SS 396 4-SPEED DOCUMENTED
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It has become more of a biz and less of a hobby each day. [/ QUOTE ] Yep. It's all about the money. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/no.gif Someone just posted on the Nova site that they are in posession of the original motor! https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...ns/shocked.gif |
Re: 1970 L78 NOVA SS 396 4-SPEED DOCUMENTED
Wow, I hope the owner of the motor (or at least the guy who claims to have it), posts the pics in this thread!
As for the money part, I agree, but I think those days are coming to a close fairly soon. Increased knowledge and skepticism of questionable cars is quickly bringing prices of all but the best of the best in line again. Every second car on ebay lately has been run at least a couple of times before it ever sells...and at a much lower price than original requested. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/beers.gif |
Re: 1970 L78 NOVA SS 396 4-SPEED DOCUMENTED
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As for the money part, I agree, but I think those days are coming to a close fairly soon. Increased knowledge and skepticism of questionable cars is quickly bringing prices of all but the best of the best in line again. Every second car on ebay lately has been run at least a couple of times before it ever sells...and at a much lower price than original requested. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/beers.gif [/ QUOTE ] As Martha Stewart would say - "And that's a good thing!" |
Re: 1970 L78 NOVA SS 396 4-SPEED DOCUMENTED
This will be my last reply on this matter.I won;t use actual names as I would prefer not to pregidious any pending up coming litigation. I bought this car over a year ago and attached to this car came a very interesting story. As the legend goes two 1970 Nova SS were owned by two brothers. The story went on to say for some strange reason they decided to swap engines in the late 70;s one car being my L78 and the other a L34.After purchasing the L78 Nova with the L34 engine, we made numerous attempts to obtain the info on the other Nova owner to recover the original engine.After numerous attempts and no luck we proceeded to find try and find him on our own. By addvertising his and our car vin no and story we hoped He would see it and contact us.In the search we got a call we were hoping for from a gentilman who claimed to have the L78 block with our vin no. However he knew nothing about our car or the other NOVA SS.Being very sceptical after after hearing the story's on the two cars .After having the block examined we paid for it, feeling confident it was the original motor .We completed the restoration and registered the car for sale at RM auction.Four days prior to the sale we get a e-mail from this so called gentleman posing as a buyer for my car.WE gave all info requested vin numbers casting ect.First thing he proceeded to do was falsely accuse me of re stamping the L 34 engine and dressing it up as a L 78. At this time he admitted to me he was the owner of the other L 34 NOVA SS and he was going to report me for engine restampin.I advised and assured him the L 34 was still safe and untouched in my warehouse and waiting for him upon reaching an agreement. At this time He now declared he had my engine in his car. I was shocked and amazed as I had already paid for and had inspected by a very knowledgeable Chevy guy. If what he claimed to be true I needed proof too pull the car from the auction and deal with the seller of the engine. I told him if in fact this was the case I would be more than happy too make any kind of trade to reunite both cars and engine;S. At this point he started to go sideways and backwards.He said he wanted his engine ,but wouldn't;t return mine nor would he call me or let me call him to discuss the matter. All he wanted was me to give him a price on his engine over e-mail which I would t do until he was able to provide me proof He had mine.What he was able to send me was a picture of top of a engine in a NOVA . I told him sorry not good enough so he sent me two shots of the engine pad with assembly dates and cko suffix ., with No Vin present at all and tried to declare this as absolute proof.What he implied at this point that if he could get his engine because he was financially handicapped and ill for some consideration that there would be no reason for him to send me his SUPPOSED original engine for my car as mine was already correct and his would never leave his car.IN RESPONSE to that I told him I would drop his engine off a cliff and for him to PISS OFF.Then he proceeded to e-mail RM auction and accused us of re stamping the NOVA and RM intern requested proof of this claim of which couldn;t provide.I do have the pictures and e-mails he sent to me and I sent to him which are in safe keeping. I will gladly post the pictures of his so called proof if somebody can advise me on doing so . At this point it is now over two weeks from when he first contacted us you would think by now he could have his engine stamped to match mine.And this is what has started all this nonsense on my car
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Re: 1970 L78 NOVA SS 396 4-SPEED DOCUMENTED
Okay, I'll step into this one even though I really don't have a dog in this fight. However, I hate to see something that appears to be misrepresented - especially considering that I'd love to have a car like this and would really be pi$$ed if I paid huge dollars for something that was not as I was lead to believe. Ask yourself if you'd be upset too.
It really comes down to one man's story against another. I won't take sides, but will present the information that was given to me and let you decide. This comes from the person that has the facts, first-hand knowledge, details, and some back-up information. In the interest of clearing up a few questions on this forum, I'll relay the information that I have, including a summary in his own words. The Nova on Ebay appears to really be a factory SS 396 L78 car. There is no dispute about that. I've attached a copy of the order sheet. The issue surrounds the original "born-with" matching-numbers engine that is advertised to be with it. That Nova on Ebay and the one that my friend has were owned by the same person in the 70's. Both Novas were/are nearly identical in color and options (forest green, bench seats, 4-speeds, steel rims with dog-dish caps, etc). The primary differences were in the engine (L34 vs. L78, green vs. black interior, and exterior decoration (body side moldings vs. window trim). As mentioned, one Nova was a factory L34 and the other was an L78. The L34 Nova was and is still a super nice low-mileage car that was taken good care of. The L78 had the issues typical with a Canadian weathered car and was the rougher car of the two. The owner at the time decided to sell the factory L78 Nova and keep the factory L34 Nova. However, prior to selling it, he did a motor swap so that he'd have the more powerful L78 motor in the best condition car (the L34). The transplanted L78 Nova (with its L34 engine) went on its merry way and is the yellow car you have seen prior to the restoration that is documented here. http://www.angelfire.com/ut2/dpmusclecars/70novass.html At this point, the Nova was still sporting the L34 from my friend's car. Somewhere in the restoration process, it become a matching-numbers L78 again. This can be a problem when the original L78 motor is still firmly anchored in another Nova. Bottom line: There appears to be no blown-up grenaded engines, nor photos of one. There is only the factory original L78 for the car, and a "created" one in it now. Here it is in his own words. ================================================== ======== The story behind the "matching numbers" documented L-78 1970 Nova SS on ebay is this. The VIN to this car is 114270W358856. This car was owned, along with the present day 1970 Nova SS Big Block car which i now own 114270W298215, by one and the same fellow in Hamilton, Ontario in the mid 70's to mid 80's. I have had contact with this prior owner for several years now and he has told me of the engine swap between the two cars which he himself did back in '78. I have also multiple vintage photos of both cars together with the engines pulled, side by side, awaiting the swap, and a long history on both cars when they resided as a pair. I have had the 358856 Nova on my radar screen for a while now, and have viewed it as recent as '06 when it was Old Yellow and owned by Jim H. in Hamilton. I viewed the car personally and know the engine code to have been T0324 CTX 298215 at that recent date, the match to my present car. I tried to work a deal on the purchase of either the car or just the motor so as to get my "original" factory motor back but it didn't work out. In 'spring of '06 the 358856 Nova was sold and taken to auction in Toronto and purchased by the current seller. I saw a link to the restoration of this car online by the seller and immediately recognized the car as the one which I knew to be the mate to the one I now own. Upon asking the seller about the engine after restoration, he quickly offered me the #'s on the engine pad and they matched exactly the engine pad #'s on the car I now own. My present engine being the one that was "factory installed" in the 358856 Nova on Ebay. When confronted with this, the seller quickly said that the engine in the car was pulled and he "LOCATED" the factory original engine by some stroke of luck since he purchased the car at auction. So, now there exist 2 1970 Nova Big Block cars with the same exact engine code and VIN. One being the original and one a "re-stamp". Which one is the real deal? You be the judge. He kept asking for a photo of the stamping on mine, and with the engine installed and hoses and lines in the way, it is no easy task. One can see it clearly with the naked eye but all the camera can catch is the initial "heavier stamp" of the TO603CKO...the 358856 is visible to the naked eye but with many attempts it can't be captured by the camera lens. I tried for over an hour today and couldn't get a sight on the # through the lens. I invite anyone to view it and it will clearly show the VIN to be the same exact one to the 358856 car for sale now. I know my engine to be the one and true L-78 engine and not tampered with in the past 37 years. Maybe the seller should share with us how he happened to come across this engine after almost 30 years of seperation and multiple owners........ should be interesting. This is the true story behind the 2 Nova Big Blocks..coming full circle once again. P.S. the b/w copy of the insurance binder is to show that both cars were owned by the same owner in Hamilton, Ont. back in the day along with some other truck. This puts both cars together at the time the swap was done. ================================================== == Here are some photos: http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q65/nova_ss396/G.jpg http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...hNovasin78.jpg http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...dstamping1.jpg http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...8photos094.jpg http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...8photos095.jpg PLEASE note that nothing slanderous to the seller of that car or anyone else is intended by the post. It's just a presentation of some history. Unfortunately, none of this would even be discussed if the car was advertised or being sold as a factory L78 with a non-original motor. That's not such a bad thing at all either. All Novas are cool, whether matching numbers or not. Anyway, that's the information that I have. Again, nothing is being posted with the intention of disrespecting anyone or calling them out. It's all about the car itself. If I wanted to really start the mud-slinging, I'd have posted copies of the hateful and threatening emails that were sent by the seller to the gentleman who merely inquired about the and mentioned actually having the factory born-with motor. Those notes weren't cool at all and were quite rude and nasty. It's quite a shame that people need to conduct themselves that way. People tend to lose their civility when blinded by greed (just my observation). To wrap this up, here's a shot of that L78 motor that SHOULD be in that Nova on Ebay. http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...8photos012.jpg http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...8photos026.jpg |
Re: 1970 L78 NOVA SS 396 4-SPEED DOCUMENTED
You mean you wouldn't pull a few hoses and brackets to get your original engine back. Now that is lazy.
Jason |
Re: 1970 L78 NOVA SS 396 4-SPEED DOCUMENTED
Thanks Allen....now people can decide what they want to think if they are interested in the car...
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Re: 1970 L78 NOVA SS 396 4-SPEED DOCUMENTED
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Thanks Allen....now people can decide what they want to think if they are interested in the car... [/ QUOTE ] I'm going to quote Rodney King and say "Why can't we all just get along?". The cars are what they are. You'd think people could amicably work things out, especially given the unique story about the cars and the fact that both they and their respective motors still exist. I'm just not a fan of the whole restamping thing, whether the seller did it or someone sold him a restamped motor. With the dollars being asked for a nice car like that, no one needs to be mislead if there is more information available. |
Re: 1970 L78 NOVA SS 396 4-SPEED DOCUMENTED
The fact that th cars and both engines still exists is pretty cool. Restamping sucks. Maybe after the dust settles this can get worked out . People just love drama.
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Re: 1970 L78 NOVA SS 396 4-SPEED DOCUMENTED
Thankyou Allen for presenting a polite factual seeming manner.
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Re: 1970 L78 NOVA SS 396 4-SPEED DOCUMENTED
Im so used to seeing stamp pads with straight stampings.
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Re: 1970 L78 NOVA SS 396 4-SPEED DOCUMENTED
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Im so used to seeing stamp pads with straight stampings. [/ QUOTE ]Thats funny you should say that jerry m said that one of mine looked like a amature restamp because 2 of the numbers are not perfectly aligned he said they used a gang stamp and they should be perfect oh well I really dont care I like the car any way |
Re: 1970 L78 NOVA SS 396 4-SPEED DOCUMENTED
Can we see a pic of it Joey ?
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Re: 1970 L78 NOVA SS 396 4-SPEED DOCUMENTED
Now about that paid members only can post in classifieds......
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Re: 1970 L78 NOVA SS 396 4-SPEED DOCUMENTED
Allen, thanks for clearing that up. I guess I was wrong/mislead from years ago about the motor being broke. For that, I'm sorry. I was just passing on info that I recall from knowing this car for years as well.
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Re: 1970 L78 NOVA SS 396 4-SPEED DOCUMENTED
So does the guy who claims to have the original motor have the wrong motor in his car?
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Re: 1970 L78 NOVA SS 396 4-SPEED DOCUMENTED
------BigG,,,Give it up. If you reign this in right now and do the right thing you can still salvage this. Get your original engine back. Help get the 350hp motor back in the correct hole and you can still hold your head up. As a matter of fact, Id add the cost of all this to the price as this story line will probably support the higher price. Hey,,, youre left with a good 396/375 engine for another project too. In the end it doesnt matter where you got the engine in the car today because it simply isnt the original, IMHO!!!........Bill S
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Re: 1970 L78 NOVA SS 396 4-SPEED DOCUMENTED
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So does the guy who claims to have the original motor have the wrong motor in his car? [/ QUOTE ] The right guy claims to have the wrong motor in his car, that motor, he claims is for the right car, which the wrong guy has. It's pretty simple to follow after reading it six times and assuming everyone is telling the truth. Hopefully the interested parties can work it out and get everything where it belongs and grind down the fake pad. |
Re: 1970 L78 NOVA SS 396 4-SPEED DOCUMENTED
I dont want to open up that can of worms again charlie surely you understand
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Re: 1970 L78 NOVA SS 396 4-SPEED DOCUMENTED
I would love to see a pic of both cars side by side agin this year with a motor swap being preformed now that would be cool!!!!!!! https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/cool.gif
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Re: 1970 L78 NOVA SS 396 4-SPEED DOCUMENTED
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[ QUOTE ] So does the guy who claims to have the original motor have the wrong motor in his car? [/ QUOTE ] The right guy claims to have the wrong motor in his car, that motor, he claims is for the right car, which the wrong guy has. [/ QUOTE ] https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/grin.gif "This is like deja vu all over again." "You can observe a lot just by watching." "He must have made that before he died." -- Referring to a Steve McQueen movie. "I'd find the fellow who lost it, and, if he was poor, I'd return it." -- When asked what he would do if he found a million dollars. "You've got to be very careful if you don't know where you're going, because you might not get there." "I knew I was going to take the wrong train, so I left early." "If you don't know where you are going, you will wind up somewhere else." "If you can't imitate him, don't copy him." "You better cut the pizza in four pieces because I'm not hungry enough to eat six." "It was impossible to get a conversation going; everybody was talking too much." "A nickel isn't worth a dime today." "Nobody goes there anymore; it's too crowded." "It gets late early out there." -- Referring to the bad sun conditions in left field at the stadium. "Do you mean now?" -- When asked for the time. "I take a two hour nap, from one o'clock to four." "If you come to a fork in the road, take it." "You give 100 percent in the first half of the game, and if that isn't enough in the second half you give what's left." "90% of the putts that are short don't go in." "I made a wrong mistake." "I always thought that record would stand until it was broken." "Yeah, but we're making great time!" -- In reply to "Hey Yogi, I think we're lost." "If the fans don't come out to the ball park, you can't stop them." "It's never happened in the World Series competition, and it still hasn't." "How long have you known me, Jack? And you still don't know how to spell my name." -- Upon receiving a check from Jack Buck made out to "bearer." "The other teams could make trouble for us if they win." "I never blame myself when I'm not hitting. I just blame the bat, and if it keeps up, I change bats. After all, if I know it isn't my fault that I'm not hitting, how can I get mad at myself?" " "I didn't really say everything I said." |
Re: 1970 L78 NOVA SS 396 4-SPEED DOCUMENTED
One of my Grandfather's favorites was: "It looked so nice out this morning, that I decided to leave it out all day"
wilma https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/grin.gif |
Re: 1970 L78 NOVA SS 396 4-SPEED DOCUMENTED
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Re: 1970 L78 NOVA SS 396 4-SPEED DOCUMENTED
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...Who's on first? https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...s/confused.gif https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...iggthumpup.gif [/ QUOTE ] Restamps on first Numbers matching on second And I dunno's on third https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/no.gif |
Re: 1970 L78 NOVA SS 396 4-SPEED DOCUMENTED
Here's another VIN pad picture after it was cleaned up a litle more.
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...nginecode3.jpg |
Re: 1970 L78 NOVA SS 396 4-SPEED DOCUMENTED
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Re: 1970 L78 NOVA SS 396 4-SPEED DOCUMENTED
YES ALLEN , true story !!! good job .I owned the L34 IN THE 80'S LOW MILE CAR LIKE NEW !! PURCHASED IT FROM ONE OF THE BROTHER'S .I SOLD IT TO A GUY IN THURDER BAY OR NORTH BAY ?? IN 1987-88-89 ??
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Re: 1970 L78 NOVA SS 396 4-SPEED DOCUMENTED
Allen is that a real stamnping or a fake.?
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Re: 1970 L78 NOVA SS 396 4-SPEED DOCUMENTED
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Allen is that a real stamnping or a fake.? [/ QUOTE ] The real one. |
Re: 1970 L78 NOVA SS 396 4-SPEED DOCUMENTED
That is what I thought Al because my 70 L78 Nova (a month behind that Car) has the EXACT same stamping, especially on the VIN, it is almost invisible on the top and deep on the bottom, wasn't a square hit at the factory on the VIN stamp
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Re: 1970 L78 NOVA SS 396 4-SPEED DOCUMENTED
Allen, nice job outlining the story - I was losing track of who-had-what.
So, the current seller restamped the L34 block? Now the L34 owner's engine will need a restamp to bring the numbers back in line? What a shame https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/no.gif |
Re: 1970 L78 NOVA SS 396 4-SPEED DOCUMENTED
-------Jim,,,Those numbers were whacked with the head on of course, and because of that were often light on the up side. Just think about the guy with the hammer and how he might get the gang holder a little too close to the head, and this is what you get.........Bill S
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Re: 1970 L78 NOVA SS 396 4-SPEED DOCUMENTED
No Marlin. The seller says he still has the orig engine in his shop.
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Re: 1970 L78 NOVA SS 396 4-SPEED DOCUMENTED
Oh, that's good. So, there is an opportunity for both cars to get their original engines back - forget who owns what, reunite the engines!!
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