Re: Survivor ?????
 

Here's a conversation about one of Sammy's other Loves...........LOL

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a2...h_MOV02794.jpg

Ken

Re: Survivor ?????
 

[ QUOTE ]
I was told at Vettefest, "at least you could of cleaned up all the rust"!!

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Don't touch that car! Furthermore, if the "rust" comment came from a judge, Mr. Ashton needs to correct that train of thought. Judging from input on this particular thread, shows that venues of signifigant awards need to create some separation for original cars. As mentioned before, all the little chalk marks, paint dabs, and small details of a car NEED to be preserved. If you have not figured it out, I am a huge fan of original cars. Charlie's new car is something not many are going to live up to. If Charlie's car is the determining factor if you keep your car original (or parts of it) vs. restoring it.........we are going to wreck a lot of good references!

Re: Survivor ?????
 

Keeping even a certain section such as engine compartment, chassis, interior, or exterior orignal helps everyone... I personally love to look at the orignal paint cars... there is something about the way the lead was done the grind marks the lacquer checks... it is great to look at... the translucence and surface qualities of the old lacquer are not duplicated...

Re: Survivor ?????
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Not if it was repainted IMO. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/dunno.gif All original but????

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Don't get hung up on the term survivor. They defined it and trademarked it in late 70's early 80's. That standard has not changed. As I mentioned above....your definition of survivor is referred to as a benchmark car. If your not satisfied come up with your own term.

In Vintage Camaro we use our own terms, our highest level is legend which is similar to benchmark, however we include inspect/certify the underside via a lift which allows us more access to critical components and hardware. We also have 3 other levels based on how unrestored/original the car is. There are many cars that are repainted yet absolutely untouched in all other areas and they need to be preserved and recogonized.

An unrestored car is so much more than just paint. For example yes Charley's car is mostly original paint (great), but 90 percent of his pics were of components, hardware, finishes , inspection marks, stickers and such (most of the questions and interest were in those areas). That to me is where the assembly secrets are and where we gain the most knowledge of the "factory assembly processes".

I have passion for original paint cars, but only so much can be learned from it. Looking at virgin engine compartment, interior and trunk and underbody is equally as important.

I understand your point Sam, but if we let everyone redefine survivor then we lose THE standard and it becomes too subjective and open to anyones interpretation.

[/ QUOTE ] Steve, I could not agree more, while I wish my car had original paint, looking at a mint 20K mile california frame, with a virtually untouched engine compartment and 100% original interior is also a significant source of information. Should a car like this be restored because it has been painted? I say absolutely not.

Re: Survivor ?????
 

Steve, send it to Texas. We'll take care of the aging of that red paint..........https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/haha.gif

Re: Survivor ?????
 

[ QUOTE ]
Steve, send it to Texas. We'll take care of the aging of that red paint..........https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/haha.gif

[/ QUOTE ] Tim, I'm sure that the Texas sun would do wonders in making the paint "appear" original LOL.

Re: Survivor ?????
 

Especially if Tim and I drove it around to get some rock chips. I'd be happy to store it in the Garajamjal so we can do that! Better than driving it in that snow up in Chicago!

Re: Survivor ?????
 

Steve, we're only concerned about your best interest..... https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...ns/naughty.gif

Re: Survivor ?????
 

I love survivor cars. Original paint is a must in my book to be considered a true survivor. I own a #'s matching L78 Pace Car that I would consider a survivor car. Some on this site have questioned how well it has survived but it is what it is. Very rust free, 63K miles, original paint, original drivetrain, original interior. I replaced some of the consumable parts, the carpet, exhaust and added the correct smog. Other than that just about everything else is original. Even the hood insulation. I did paint the exhaust manifolds.....I couldn't help myself. You can't tell by looking at it but it's been completely and correctly gone through mechanically. I differentiate between restoring and repairing. I don't think any of the things I've done compromise it's survivor status. At least I hope not. JMO.

http://katyclassiccars.com/L78PaceCar/a.jpg

http://katyclassiccars.com/L78PaceCar/b.jpg

http://katyclassiccars.com/L78PaceCar/c.jpg

http://katyclassiccars.com/L78PaceCar/d.jpg

Re: Survivor ?????
 

Great Pace Car, L78 automatic. Wow......
Probably optioned similar to the actual one. I think it was a JL8, L89 automatic.

Re: Survivor ?????
 

Thats a nice car Rick! I would even wipe down the inner fenders,subframe, motor compartment, firewall etc. with WD40 or Boeshield and a rag. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...iggthumpup.gif

Re: Survivor ?????
 

Rick....................Listen to Sammy.........He's the "Master" of Detailing..... https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...ns/scholar.gif

Ken https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/flag.gif(Trying to walk in Sammy's Footsteps) https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/hmmm.gif

Re: Survivor ?????
 

Also I like to use the old KIT or Rally wax. They seem to bring up the old lacquer paint better than the newer base coat clear coat wax. A soft tooth brush and a "little" compund may remove some of those off color rust areas on the paint. Keep it original, its a nizzze car! https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...iggthumpup.gif https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...ns/worship.gif

Re: Survivor ?????
 

Didn't know they made Kit wax anymore,haven't herd that name for a longtime.

Re: Survivor ?????
 

I have to agree with Steve Shauger. Just a whole lot of common sense in what he is saying. Frank

Re: Survivor ?????
 

Thanks for the advice Sam. That pic was taken before I had it all buttoned up. I do try to keep it well lubed with WD40. The second law of thermodynamics never takes a day off on the gulf coast. There's rust in the air, along with salt and lots of water.

Kit or Rally wax you say. I'll be looking for some of that tomorrow.

Thanks again

Re: Survivor ?????
 

When I brought my 67 home, my brother-in-law didn't even want me to detail under the hood. He said "that's thirty year old dirt... you can't touch it!" https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/dunno.gif

He's kinda right... my favorite shot of the car is the one showing how the car was found, under years of dust.
http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/g.../67RFdusty.jpg
http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/g...rt/67Motor.jpg

We all appreciate something different about these old survivors, so the less you touch the better.

Re: Survivor ?????
 

I bought my KIT wax at an automotive store and my RALLY wax on line. Nice car Helmut!!! https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...iggthumpup.gif